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Post by Cincinnati Reds - Chris on May 17, 2021 15:26:58 GMT -5
League wide discussion on the ability to Poach and if we want to make changes to the process.
If you have any suggestions or comments on our current poaching rule process please bring it up here.
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Post by Houston Astros on May 17, 2021 15:34:54 GMT -5
My personal thoughts:
I think 72 hours is more than enough time to make a move on way or the other. For instance, if a guy is brought up for a double header and sent back down, it’s enough time where you don’t have to bring him up and make a move.
If we lengthen that time we might as well not poach - waiting 5 days is a considerable amount of time and I think we”lol forget about the poach.
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Post by Cincinnati Reds - Chris on May 18, 2021 9:27:09 GMT -5
What about eliminating the ability to poach for the remainder of the 2021 season.
And we visit the rule in the offseason to make it work. League wide discussions so no one can say they weren't involved in the process
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Post by Red Sox on May 18, 2021 10:07:48 GMT -5
This keeps people honest so I hate to see it go for the season without it being replaced with something.
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Post by St. Louis Cardinals (Andrew) on May 18, 2021 17:07:42 GMT -5
There is no doubt the current rule is broken, we talk about it each year but haven’t been able to come up with a perfect outcome. The poaching rule is a very important one though so it needs to be in, in some form.
I like A’s idea in the other thread, we could adopt aversion of the rule 5 MLB rules, something along the lines of ‘if you win a player through poach you need to keep him on your MLB roster for the rest of that season or offer him back for free to the team you took him off’.
I think 72 hours is reasonable, it’s 3 full days. Along with the ‘options’ rules, these were put in place to stop teams from using their MILB roster as, effectively, an extended MLB roster.
Is there any ideas out there on ways the poaching rule could be improved ?
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Post by Houston Astros on May 18, 2021 17:38:26 GMT -5
I think Chris mentioned that idea (or a version of it) not too long ago. I like the idea of sending them back if they are not on your 31-man roster.
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Post by yankees on May 19, 2021 5:27:04 GMT -5
What if the poaching rule applies only to players that exceeded minors eligibility before the season began? Would allow teams to keep recent prospects.
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Post by Halejon/Nationals GM on May 20, 2021 8:24:07 GMT -5
Serious question because I've never quite got it: what is the poaching rule meant to prevent? Stockpiling crappy major leaguers in the minors? Not calling up prospects quickly enough? If we're clear on that I'm sure we could come up with a standard for call-ups that targets the issue and isn't unequally enforced, which is my problem with the current system.
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Post by Deleted on May 20, 2021 12:29:18 GMT -5
Serious question because I've never quite got it: what is the poaching rule meant to prevent? Stockpiling crappy major leaguers in the minors? Not calling up prospects quickly enough? If we're clear on that I'm sure we could come up with a standard for call-ups that targets the issue and isn't unequally enforced, which is my problem with the current system. I agree with this statement. My thoughts were the rule was basically put in place so someone doesn't hoard mlb guys in their minor league roster? |
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Post by BrewCrewGM on May 20, 2021 13:42:28 GMT -5
Serious question because I've never quite got it: what is the poaching rule meant to prevent? Stockpiling crappy major leaguers in the minors? Not calling up prospects quickly enough? If we're clear on that I'm sure we could come up with a standard for call-ups that targets the issue and isn't unequally enforced, which is my problem with the current system. The former. Not easy to find ABs in this league. |
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Post by doubleupagus on May 23, 2021 6:00:30 GMT -5
I agree that it should be pretty easy to craft a rule that combats the mischief it is intended to prevent, which is the stockpiling of mediocre bodies at our minor league level are on irl MLB rosters and who could be used by someone here to meet AB or IP minimums. We're not really even talking about those quad AAAA guys who get called up and sent down every day. We're talking about those reserve 25th and 26th bodies who get a start or two a week and a couple pinch hit chances.
I do NOT think it should be used to mandate the promotion of prospects before owners are ready.
I would propose that it be limited to players who are over prospect limits, which would be what? 125 ABs or 50 IPs?
I think a player should not be eligible to be poached until he has been on the irl MLB roster for 3 days. I was going to say ten, but that's too long. Three days shows some sign by the irl team that the guy is not just a one day call up. Given the proposal for requiring you to keep him on your roster if you poach, I would say that a poach bid is automatically cancelled if the MLB team options or DFAs the guy within the poach period (that's what? 72 hours from the announcement of the bid?)
I DO like the idea that if you poach a guy you are required to keep him on your roster to the end of the season or give him back to the tea you poached from.
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Post by Deleted on May 24, 2021 13:51:41 GMT -5
One guy that comes to mine is Michael Chavis, he was just up for ten days then got demoted again? With the rules, he's technically allowed to get poach since he's up for 3 days so my options are to either promote him and then demote him and make another roster move for a guy who's only up for a week or risk losing him to someone poaching him? Or the other option is I waste a roster spot on him for when he's called up, which I have no idea since we're going based on actual mlb. Not saying I have a solution, maybe a small taxi squad that isn't eligible to be poached, but you can only put a guy on that squad for one season? Like real mlb with the 40 man roster, then owners can make the adequate moves in the offseason with their roster instead of being on a 3 day crunch.
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Post by Cincinnati Reds - Chris on May 24, 2021 17:55:40 GMT -5
Clarification on a hypothetical. Mike Trout cannot be placed on a TPB farm if he's on the Angels 26 man IRL, correct?
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Post by St. Louis Cardinals (Andrew) on May 24, 2021 18:05:40 GMT -5
Clarification on a hypothetical. Mike Trout cannot be placed on a TPB farm if he's on the Angels 26 man IRL, correct? Wouldn’t have thought so |
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Post by Cincinnati Reds - Chris on May 24, 2021 19:55:17 GMT -5
Another consideration for Manager's yo-yo'ing guys between their majors & minors is the options they're burning through.
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Post by doubleupagus on May 25, 2021 16:37:30 GMT -5
I don't see anything in the rules that would prevent an owner from stashing Mike Trout on his 60 man roster -- for so long as it took another owner to poach him like this morning's ... trout.
I have a question: Who is in charge of keeping track of options? That seems like a thankless job.
The work that goes into this is impressive. I just show up and play.
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Post by St. Louis Cardinals (Andrew) on May 25, 2021 17:35:26 GMT -5
Not sure how this became about Trout but he hasn’t been sent to the minors so no, he couldn’t be sent there anyway. DL rehab assignments aren’t being sent to minors so they don’t count either.
The key challenge I see, and no offence to M’s comment above, the reason why Options and Poaching rules were brought in was to stop a team effectively running a 50 man MLB roster, sending those under 150 AB and 50 IP up and down as you wish (albeit, granted that won’t last long). The rules were brought into play to make managers make tough decisions.
On the flip side, I do think there needs to be a grace period, something along the lines of 7 days before a player can be poached. That way, if a guy is only up for the weekend, he can’t be poached (but be mindful you’ll burn an option for what may be 2 games).
Definitely need to sort the rule out though, it’s not great in its current format.
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Post by Houston Astros on May 25, 2021 17:39:24 GMT -5
Not sure how this became about Trout but he hasn’t been sent to the minors so no, he couldn’t be sent there anyway. DL rehab assignments aren’t being sent to minors so they don’t count either. The key challenge I see, and no offence to M’s comment above, the reason why Options and Poaching rules were brought in was to stop a team effectively running a 50 man MLB roster, sending those under 150 AB and 50 IP up and down as you wish (albeit, granted that won’t last long). The rules were brought into play to make managers make tough decisions. On the flip side, I do think there needs to be a grace period, something along the lines of 7 days before a player can be poached. That way, if a guy is only up for the weekend, he can’t be poached (but be mindful you’ll burn an option for what may be 2 games). Definitely need to sort the rule out though, it’s not great in its current format. I agree with this sentiment - i do like the idea of the options and tough decisions. |
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